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	<title>Comments on: Presidents, puppies and taking responsibility</title>
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	<link>http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/2008/12/15/presidents-puppies-and-taking-responsibility/</link>
	<description>Animals, veterinary medicine and history, religion and more...</description>
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		<title>By: mouthyorange</title>
		<link>http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/2008/12/15/presidents-puppies-and-taking-responsibility/#comment-47</link>
		<dc:creator>mouthyorange</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 17:17:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/?p=29#comment-47</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s cool, bn — I think your blogs will be worth waiting for.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s cool, bn — I think your blogs will be worth waiting for.</p>
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		<title>By: brebisnoire</title>
		<link>http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/2008/12/15/presidents-puppies-and-taking-responsibility/#comment-44</link>
		<dc:creator>brebisnoire</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Dec 2008 05:28:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/?p=29#comment-44</guid>
		<description>thanks mouthyorange - me too! My internet connection where I&#039;m visiting comes in and out, and I&#039;m in a holidays brain fog. I can think, but can&#039;t seem to write.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>thanks mouthyorange &#8211; me too! My internet connection where I&#8217;m visiting comes in and out, and I&#8217;m in a holidays brain fog. I can think, but can&#8217;t seem to write.</p>
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		<title>By: mouthyorange</title>
		<link>http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/2008/12/15/presidents-puppies-and-taking-responsibility/#comment-43</link>
		<dc:creator>mouthyorange</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Dec 2008 13:07:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/?p=29#comment-43</guid>
		<description>Me again —

I&#039;m so looking forward to your next post!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Me again —</p>
<p>I&#8217;m so looking forward to your next post!</p>
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		<title>By: mouthyorange</title>
		<link>http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/2008/12/15/presidents-puppies-and-taking-responsibility/#comment-42</link>
		<dc:creator>mouthyorange</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 12:34:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/?p=29#comment-42</guid>
		<description>I second your comment that it&#039;s the responsible adult&#039;s behaviour and competence that makes all the difference.

Speaking of travelling with animals, you may appreciate this image. When my first Bouvier&#039;s breeder and her husband and young son moved from Nova Scotia to Ontario, they loaded all six of her adult Bouvs into their van, including my pup-to-be&#039;s pregnant mom. It was over twenty years ago and it was harder then to find motels in these parts that would take pets. So they pulled up to a motel in the evening, signed in, said nothing about the dogs, and then she and her husband took turns running back and forth in the dark sneaking the dogs one or two at a time from the van into their motel room. The next morning they got up before dawn and hustled the dogs out to the van again, and left. It seems that no one ever knew the difference. And somehow, nothing started the dogs barking during the night!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I second your comment that it&#8217;s the responsible adult&#8217;s behaviour and competence that makes all the difference.</p>
<p>Speaking of travelling with animals, you may appreciate this image. When my first Bouvier&#8217;s breeder and her husband and young son moved from Nova Scotia to Ontario, they loaded all six of her adult Bouvs into their van, including my pup-to-be&#8217;s pregnant mom. It was over twenty years ago and it was harder then to find motels in these parts that would take pets. So they pulled up to a motel in the evening, signed in, said nothing about the dogs, and then she and her husband took turns running back and forth in the dark sneaking the dogs one or two at a time from the van into their motel room. The next morning they got up before dawn and hustled the dogs out to the van again, and left. It seems that no one ever knew the difference. And somehow, nothing started the dogs barking during the night!</p>
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		<title>By: brebis noire</title>
		<link>http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/2008/12/15/presidents-puppies-and-taking-responsibility/#comment-41</link>
		<dc:creator>brebis noire</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Dec 2008 15:51:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/?p=29#comment-41</guid>
		<description>mouthyorange, I&#039;ve never travelled with animals, but I&#039;m always intrigued by people who do (I can&#039;t help smiling when I see dogs and cats going through airport security - I wouldn&#039;t put my cats throught that, but never say never, eh). 
I&#039;ve travelled with kids, and as far as I&#039;m concerned, it shouldn&#039;t be any more difficult - in fact I bet it&#039;s easier - to travel with a large dog than with a small child. A dog shouldn&#039;t make any more mess or noise or cause more trouble than a child. :-)

As with children, it&#039;s the responsible adult&#039;s behaviour and competence that makes all the difference.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>mouthyorange, I&#8217;ve never travelled with animals, but I&#8217;m always intrigued by people who do (I can&#8217;t help smiling when I see dogs and cats going through airport security &#8211; I wouldn&#8217;t put my cats throught that, but never say never, eh).<br />
I&#8217;ve travelled with kids, and as far as I&#8217;m concerned, it shouldn&#8217;t be any more difficult &#8211; in fact I bet it&#8217;s easier &#8211; to travel with a large dog than with a small child. A dog shouldn&#8217;t make any more mess or noise or cause more trouble than a child. <img src='http://s.wordpress.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>As with children, it&#8217;s the responsible adult&#8217;s behaviour and competence that makes all the difference.</p>
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		<title>By: mouthyorange</title>
		<link>http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/2008/12/15/presidents-puppies-and-taking-responsibility/#comment-40</link>
		<dc:creator>mouthyorange</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Dec 2008 14:42:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/?p=29#comment-40</guid>
		<description>I&#039;d like to add a hopeful note to go with your comment, brebis noire.

For about 15 years, I&#039;ve taken my very large dog on road trips. (I&#039;ve had more than one dog during that time, but only one at a time, just for the record.) I am usually able to find a motel somewhere that allows dogs, even big ones. When we expressed our appreciation to one Canadian motel owner, he said that in his experience it&#039;s not the animals who have parties and trash the rooms and destroy things — it&#039;s people. He said that people have cost him far more in repairs than anyone&#039;s dog ever did.

Then again, my experience has been mainly in Ontario, Quebec, New Brunswick and Nova Scotia. And a few states.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d like to add a hopeful note to go with your comment, brebis noire.</p>
<p>For about 15 years, I&#8217;ve taken my very large dog on road trips. (I&#8217;ve had more than one dog during that time, but only one at a time, just for the record.) I am usually able to find a motel somewhere that allows dogs, even big ones. When we expressed our appreciation to one Canadian motel owner, he said that in his experience it&#8217;s not the animals who have parties and trash the rooms and destroy things — it&#8217;s people. He said that people have cost him far more in repairs than anyone&#8217;s dog ever did.</p>
<p>Then again, my experience has been mainly in Ontario, Quebec, New Brunswick and Nova Scotia. And a few states.</p>
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		<title>By: brebis noire</title>
		<link>http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/2008/12/15/presidents-puppies-and-taking-responsibility/#comment-38</link>
		<dc:creator>brebis noire</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Dec 2008 18:56:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/?p=29#comment-38</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m very sorry Chrystal Ocean and deBeauxOs, for taking so long to respond. I hear you Chrystal - even before I started working as a vet (when I was a student, in fact), I quickly came up against this issue. Some people think that only people who can &quot;afford it&quot; should be &quot;allowed&quot; to have animals. What that doesn&#039;t take into account is a basic human need - for companionship, and the need to take care of someone else, even if that &quot;someone else&quot; is another species. I have come to understand this as a basic human need, though perhaps not felt as acutely by everyone, or in the the same way.
On the other hand, as deBeauxOs pointed out, people who don&#039;t pick up after their animals, or who allow them to soil and damage things is also an issue. My parents live in a condo as well, and luckily for them, the pet owners outnumber the non-pet owners, so they avoided having a motion passed that would ban pets. It could easily have happened, however. I think there is some kind of a consensus as to the number of pets allowed, however.

I think those kinds of limits are probably the only way to get around it. Limits on the number of animals allowed according to space are a good compromise for people and even the animals themselves (animals become stressed when the population is too dense, and cleanups have to be done more often), and to ensure the integrity of the property. I also think that rules about having animals spayed or neutered might be helpful, as this avoids many of the damage-causing behaviours. However, an all-out ban on animals is unreasonable, and even cruel, in cases where people have no other rental options. I think that as more and more people own pets, there will be more understanding on the part of property owners.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m very sorry Chrystal Ocean and deBeauxOs, for taking so long to respond. I hear you Chrystal &#8211; even before I started working as a vet (when I was a student, in fact), I quickly came up against this issue. Some people think that only people who can &#8220;afford it&#8221; should be &#8220;allowed&#8221; to have animals. What that doesn&#8217;t take into account is a basic human need &#8211; for companionship, and the need to take care of someone else, even if that &#8220;someone else&#8221; is another species. I have come to understand this as a basic human need, though perhaps not felt as acutely by everyone, or in the the same way.<br />
On the other hand, as deBeauxOs pointed out, people who don&#8217;t pick up after their animals, or who allow them to soil and damage things is also an issue. My parents live in a condo as well, and luckily for them, the pet owners outnumber the non-pet owners, so they avoided having a motion passed that would ban pets. It could easily have happened, however. I think there is some kind of a consensus as to the number of pets allowed, however.</p>
<p>I think those kinds of limits are probably the only way to get around it. Limits on the number of animals allowed according to space are a good compromise for people and even the animals themselves (animals become stressed when the population is too dense, and cleanups have to be done more often), and to ensure the integrity of the property. I also think that rules about having animals spayed or neutered might be helpful, as this avoids many of the damage-causing behaviours. However, an all-out ban on animals is unreasonable, and even cruel, in cases where people have no other rental options. I think that as more and more people own pets, there will be more understanding on the part of property owners.</p>
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		<title>By: deBeauxOs</title>
		<link>http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/2008/12/15/presidents-puppies-and-taking-responsibility/#comment-37</link>
		<dc:creator>deBeauxOs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Dec 2008 20:11:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/?p=29#comment-37</guid>
		<description>This issue is fraught with contention.  My parents lived in a non-profit, co-op housing complex for people over 55,  combining heritage row housing and a newly-constructed low-rise appartment building.  The co-op was managed by a board of directors to which residents were elected.  One of the conditions of living in the co-op was to provide 5 hours of volunteer work per month.  

Over the years, a number of irresponsible individuals allowed their animal companions to cause damage to their units.  The cumulative costs of repairing drywall, sanding floors, replacing carpets, etc. resulted in increased monthly charges for all residents.  Finally at a stormy AGM, a by-law was passed; new member residents could not bring their animal companions when they moved in; long-time residents could keep theirs but not accept any new ones into their homes.  It was a sad situation; financial concerns won out over humane considerations.

It is terrible that many are condemned to live without animal companions because of the inability of a few to care responsibly for theirs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This issue is fraught with contention.  My parents lived in a non-profit, co-op housing complex for people over 55,  combining heritage row housing and a newly-constructed low-rise appartment building.  The co-op was managed by a board of directors to which residents were elected.  One of the conditions of living in the co-op was to provide 5 hours of volunteer work per month.  </p>
<p>Over the years, a number of irresponsible individuals allowed their animal companions to cause damage to their units.  The cumulative costs of repairing drywall, sanding floors, replacing carpets, etc. resulted in increased monthly charges for all residents.  Finally at a stormy AGM, a by-law was passed; new member residents could not bring their animal companions when they moved in; long-time residents could keep theirs but not accept any new ones into their homes.  It was a sad situation; financial concerns won out over humane considerations.</p>
<p>It is terrible that many are condemned to live without animal companions because of the inability of a few to care responsibly for theirs.</p>
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		<title>By: Chrystal Ocean</title>
		<link>http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/2008/12/15/presidents-puppies-and-taking-responsibility/#comment-31</link>
		<dc:creator>Chrystal Ocean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Dec 2008 17:23:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://brebisnoire.wordpress.com/?p=29#comment-31</guid>
		<description>Love your new blog, BN, which has been added to my &quot;subscribed&quot; list.

Have a particular pet peeve, which this tweaked:

&quot;animals will be the ones who will most suffer from any economic crisis, because they are at the bottom of the chain of concern.&quot;

There are an uncommon number of people who live at the bottom of the food chain, including the homeless, who have animal companions. This is particularly so for people who live alone. Of those who are homeless, many are in that condition precisely because landlords and shelters won&#039;t permit pets in their buildings. In BC, where vacancy rates are already below 1%, 99 out of 100 landlords have no-pets clauses in their leases.

People for whom their animal companions mean the difference between life and death - literally, companionship or suicide -, are left no choice. It&#039;s either be housed or be deprived of the one living thing which helps them maintain their humanity. 

I&#039;ve two cats. They&#039;ve kept me alive these past eight years. I&#039;ve been eligible for subsidized housing all that time. But instead, because none of the subsidized housing in this province allows pets, more and more of my $8,000 income is going to pay the rent. Every year, the rent goes up while my income remains the same. There will come a time when my cats and I will be homeless because, at this point, am already paying 70% of my income on rent for this bachelor apt. 

Whenever I raise this point with people, the property owners typically insist on their property rights. How can they not see that what&#039;s really at issue is basic human rights; the right, in this case, to do whatever one needs to preserve one&#039;s life? Two decades ago, Ontario saw the light, as have other provinces. Not BC, not Alberta.

Do you have an opinion on this issue?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Love your new blog, BN, which has been added to my &#8220;subscribed&#8221; list.</p>
<p>Have a particular pet peeve, which this tweaked:</p>
<p>&#8220;animals will be the ones who will most suffer from any economic crisis, because they are at the bottom of the chain of concern.&#8221;</p>
<p>There are an uncommon number of people who live at the bottom of the food chain, including the homeless, who have animal companions. This is particularly so for people who live alone. Of those who are homeless, many are in that condition precisely because landlords and shelters won&#8217;t permit pets in their buildings. In BC, where vacancy rates are already below 1%, 99 out of 100 landlords have no-pets clauses in their leases.</p>
<p>People for whom their animal companions mean the difference between life and death &#8211; literally, companionship or suicide -, are left no choice. It&#8217;s either be housed or be deprived of the one living thing which helps them maintain their humanity. </p>
<p>I&#8217;ve two cats. They&#8217;ve kept me alive these past eight years. I&#8217;ve been eligible for subsidized housing all that time. But instead, because none of the subsidized housing in this province allows pets, more and more of my $8,000 income is going to pay the rent. Every year, the rent goes up while my income remains the same. There will come a time when my cats and I will be homeless because, at this point, am already paying 70% of my income on rent for this bachelor apt. </p>
<p>Whenever I raise this point with people, the property owners typically insist on their property rights. How can they not see that what&#8217;s really at issue is basic human rights; the right, in this case, to do whatever one needs to preserve one&#8217;s life? Two decades ago, Ontario saw the light, as have other provinces. Not BC, not Alberta.</p>
<p>Do you have an opinion on this issue?</p>
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